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Philhod
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Philhod » 08 Nov 2013

yarp, surely you can get a wind in adapter?

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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 20 Nov 2013

Sorted the oil filter now, but put the plugs in yesterday and tried to start it. All 3 spare (old) batteries I have are shagged, and won't turn it over fast enough - that said it was hovering around freezing yesterday so that didn't help. It would crank, but voltage dropped to 6 V after a couple of turns and then quickly to ~3 V. No spark also, but that could be because the Lumenition ignition seems quite sensitive to voltage - I've had it where it would crank quite happily but only fire with a jump start! Also the fuel isn't priming, which again could be down to slow cranking speed. Bought a new battery today so will see how that goes.

I checked on How Many Left?, and mine is now officially the oldest left in the UK, and the ONLY pre facelift model. I had to laugh at one of the pages on the site:

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docchevron132
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by docchevron132 » 23 Nov 2013

haha, that'll be just the one then!
Luminition is indeed extremely sensitive to voltage, like anything less than 10.6V and mine would cut.
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Philhod
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Philhod » 24 Nov 2013

Years back I had an early Lumenition unit, one with a light beam broken by a "chopper", on my Opel Manta

Snag was the chopper grabbed the wiring loom and it ceased while on holiday near Durham.
Fortunately I got a kit to return it to points and LT wire.from a local Vauxhall dealers and I never bothered to change it back 8)
72... AND STILL ROCKIN..........around the world...... NOT in a chair yet

Now XBX And into HDI.....as well as other ...err.... things.

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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 25 Nov 2013

New battery indeed span it over hugely faster, but no spark and I didn't check the voltage at the unit. I remember when it was on the road, if the heater blower was on full, the ignition controlled circuit voltage would drop so low that there would be no spark until I actually stopped cranking, at which point it would catch.

I've ordered new points and condenser as for the total cost of £7 I can just bung those on and get it started...fault finding on the ignition can wait for now. Got sidetracked with (brush) painting the front end metalwork behind the grille/headlights so will play with the engine next week.

Could do with finding a new radiator too, as the existing one has gone a little crumbly :(
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Vanny
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Vanny » 25 Nov 2013

mat_the_cat wrote:fault finding on the ignition can wait for now
Given your back ground, i'm surprised you haven't squirted it
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 25 Nov 2013

That's actually quite tempting TBH, and may well be a plan for the future. But it was all started before I had much experience of fuel injection so I went with carbs - plus I've now got a set of new ones :)

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I've also (loosely) fitted the cooling fans from the Disco...time will tell whether they're up to the job but given that it weighs half as much and I'm unlikely to regularly sit in traffic in it, hopefully I'll be OK.

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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Vanny » 25 Nov 2013

Oh yeah, i couldn't get any data for the fans btw. They where chosen and specced by Japan. Trying to find actual details wasn't going to happen. Though i haven't taken a walk down to the archive yet (might be a one way trip, and i couldn't find any rope).

The obvious suggestion was air flow velocity at 12v, measure cross sectional area, calculate LPM. Now there in, it might be better to measure the average velocity of air off the rad, would give a much better idea, taking into account pressure drop, turbulence generation. Use a hot wire about 40mm off the rad.
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 26 Nov 2013

Hmmm, new points and condenser and still no spark. Sticking my meter (set to rpm) on the -ve terminal of the coil gives a believable figure when cranking of around 100 rpm, so I'm inclined to think it's a HT problem. Should have checked that earlier, as that would have proved or disproved the Lumenition kit. Swapped the coil but no joy (the one fitted was new and tested OK resistance wise), but I've leant out my strobe light so can't check much further. King lead looking slightly dodgy, and all the others are new so may swap that next.

Fan airflow a distinct low priority at the moment :lol:
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Vanny » 26 Nov 2013

What do you need the strobe light for?
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 26 Nov 2013

If I put it on the king lead it would at least prove the system up to there, and potentially check all the other leads. It's also useful for making sure there's still a spark under compression, as I've known plugs spark OK when sat on the rocker cover, but not when back in the cylinder...

I should add that I can't work on it for more that half an hour or so at a time, so can't really get properly stuck into fault finding. Hence why the easy little jobs to do on it are so appealing!
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Vanny » 27 Nov 2013

Have you tried the old jump lead from bat neg to the head trick? Is the spark too small because the ground path is too arduous?

I've always been a fan of just lashing a spark plug in the end of the lead and holding it to the rocker, but i can see your point, you never know quite what your gonna get once its in the hole.

Nothing as simple as corrosion in the head stopping the plug making good electrical contact?

Have you checked the plugs just to see if they are sparking?
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 27 Nov 2013

Yeah, I've got one plug out and sitting on the rocker cover. If it's not sparking there it won't be any better under compression! Just that if I'd had a spark when out but not firing situation, the strobe would have been useful.

Big hefty earth strap on the block, and it cranks over fine so inclined to think the earth path is OK. Got a new king lead with me today, and thinking about it I could just put a spark plug and lead directly on the output of the coil, to see if there is a spark at that point [chin]
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Philhod
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Philhod » 27 Nov 2013

Just a thought. If it's been stood a long time, there is an earth wire under the dizzy baseplate. these have been known to sever with age, hence no sparky.

I still have that surplus BX rad if it will fit. It looks ok for width on the pic cant tell for depth.
72... AND STILL ROCKIN..........around the world...... NOT in a chair yet

Now XBX And into HDI.....as well as other ...err.... things.

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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 27 Nov 2013

You're right about the wire, but it's not actually too bad on this one. Will know more later today.

Thanks for the offer on the radiator, but I think I'm OK for that one. The rad was out of an Audi 200 Turbo, and fits between the chassis rails by a couple of mm and is nearly 2" thick (not sure a BX one would be up to the job?) Anyway, it seems like there are more radiators for sale on eBay than there can be Audi 200s actually left, so I can pick up a brand new one for £60 delivered!
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 27 Nov 2013

Finally, getting somewhere! Put a spark plug on the end of the (new) king lead and still nothing, so starting thinking there must be something fundamentally wrong. Put the meter set to rpm on the coil again…0 rpm. Balls. Given that I had a plausible cranking figure when using the Lumenition kit, so put that back on and got a spark (and an rpm figure) from the plug on the king lead.

Connected the distributer cap back up (and after a moment's head scratching when I realised the rotor arm was sat on the slam panel :oops: ) and was getting nice fat sparks at the plugs :D I'm guessing that initially the king lead was at fault, as the outer insulation had torn (as it it had been caught on something and stretched) under one of the boots. Could have easily broken the core. Fuck knows why the points didn't work though!

Sadly it's still not priming, so I'll try and rig up a gravity feed to the (mechanical) fuel pump for now. I did give it a squirt of Easy Start (reluctantly), but not even a cough :(
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 28 Nov 2013

Well that's fucking annoying. Primed the fuel system, then discovered some of the hoses had perished - all the ones with braiding had just disintegrated under the covering. So I replaced them all, then I was getting fuel to the cylinders but today, no fucking spark again. NOTHING has changed since yesterday; well clearly it has but nothing I can tell. The Lumenition unit is still trying to trigger the coil, so it's either a HT problem again, or a problem with the +ve supply to the coil. Neither should be difficult to fix but I ran out of time again :(
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by Vanny » 28 Nov 2013

what you need is the basics, petrol and an ignition source . . . [fire]
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 28 Nov 2013

Aye, going back to basics now. Seems like lack of spark was my divide by two circuit, as I removed that and it's OK. It was working yesterday so maybe some component has failed holding the coil trigger to ground? Still not actually firing though so going to check position of no. 1 piston in case the distributer has been previously put back on in a non standard position.

I put it back on in the same position as I removed it, but I've since taken all the HT leads off and put them back in the 'standard' position relative to the dizzy cap clips. Which of course may be completely wrong.
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mat_the_cat
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Re: Am I mad?

Post by mat_the_cat » 28 Nov 2013

YES!!! [wave]
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